Israel using banned weapons?

.. and for anything else
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Post by kev667 » Tue Aug 01, 2006 9:43 am

Are Israel using the 'Carpet' de-mining system as an offensive weapon? - possibly chemical or thermobaric, fuel-air.>

If so, Sky News have seen it & didn't ask any questions...

Update on IDF use of chemical weapons

From a Reader ? July 31, 2006

I'm not sure how interesting or relevant the following info is but thought I ought to at least point it out in case anyone else is interested.

Further to your earlier article on the possible use by the Israelis of the 'Carpet de-mining system' as an offensive weapon.

Here in the UK I was surprised when I turned on Sky news this morning (Monday, 31 July 2006) to see Sky's Middle East Correspondent Emma Hurd, doing a stand-up report from what she referred to as 'the Israeli-Lebanon border'. She was standing in front of an Israeli armoured vehicle on top of which were a number of young IDF soldiers apparently taking a break - drinking cans of soda etc. The camera then pulled back from a close up on Ms Hurd to frame a mid shot and revealed that mounted on the rear of the vehicle was the unmistakeable huge rectangular box of the 'Carpet' launcher.

This remained in shot over the reporter's shoulder for the rest of the report. Just visible are the tips of the individual missiles loaded into the launcher.

I first saw the report at 09:09 - 09:11 London time but was unable to record it. However Sky news have a habit of repeating these reports at hourly intervals so I'm sure that someone with access to recording equipment would be able to make a copy and post stills etc on this site.

I'm not sure how revealing this is but it does at least confirm the presence of these weapons on the border as of this morning.>



[attachmentid=323] Is Israel Using Banned Weapons?

Also see:

Do you know what kind of weapon causes this damage?>

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Post by eagleeye » Sat Aug 05, 2006 2:05 am

There was also a report in either the Guardian or Independent (I forget) in which a mere one liner suggested the Israelis are again using phosphorus. Is this a banned weapon as it should be?

The Americans used phosphorus in Falluja which was reported on Sky belatedly by DC, who had received some warning info on what to do if hit by it. Apparently even a tiny bit of it just burns right through bone.

The Israelis used phosphorus bombs in '82 on Lebanon with devastating and appalling effect. I am not at all knowledgeable about weaponry, but I imagine like most weapons, it has been further 'refined' since the early 80s.

They ordered the bunker buster bombs from the US, some of which were delivered by a stop over on these shores. Is that what they are using on the Lebanese buildings, like in Qana, where so many died in the basement, or would any bomb inflict that kind of demolition? What about cluster bombs, another atrocity of a weapon? (but not banned)

What's the point in banning landmines and allowing all of this lot? Especially as in wars nowadays, the overwhelming majority of casualties are civilians, not soldiers.

I am really angry. And before Mr Gordon Brown goes off on his family holidays somewhere peaceful and quiet, does the wannabe PM think he could spare 5 seconds for a comment on the situation in Lebanon?

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Post by guvnorgaz » Thu Aug 10, 2006 3:19 pm

They were clearing mine fields on the Lebanese border, hence the use of the carpet de-miner.

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Post by kev667 » Sun Aug 13, 2006 7:16 am

I am really angry. And before Mr Gordon Brown goes off on his family holidays somewhere peaceful and quiet, does the wannabe PM think he could spare 5 seconds for a comment on the situation in Lebanon?

Mr Brown wants to get to the top very badly. He's had his eye on No 10 for 12 long years. Oddly, as I understand it, he already lives there, having swapped the chancellor's official residence at No 11 with Tony Blair to give the prime minister more space for his growing family. But he can't pause at its front door and wave in the prime ministerial manner because he isn't yet prime minister and, with the job finally in sight, the last thing he wants is to jeopardise his chances.

He could do this: a) if he spoke out against the Israeli bombardment of southern Lebanon, or b) if he spoke out in its defence. So he has buttoned his lip, making him negligent and irresponsible, in my eyes. He needs to consider this: should a Hizbullah cell decide to hide in No 10, Israel would have no reservations about dropping a bomb on it, even though he and his wife and children were in residence.

How desirable does that make it now, eh? Sadly, no less than Balham where, given their record, an Israeli bomb aimed at Whitehall would probably land.,,1843150,00.html,00.html>

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Post by digby29 » Sun Aug 13, 2006 4:22 pm

guvnorgaz wrote:They were clearing mine fields on the Lebanese border, hence the use of the carpet de-miner.

that is true

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Post by DDP » Wed Aug 16, 2006 3:16 pm

It's all about how those weapons are deployed, not their existence. The media (other than the left-wing anti-Israeli newspapers you've mentioned) isn't ignoring anything as it isn't 'illegal' in the first place and isn't a story. Neither is WP and shouldn't be. FAEs were used by the coalition during Desert Storm, who cares? They are a tool in a lot of nations military toolbox and how they are used is often a matter of circumstance. There is no 'good' or 'humane'way to die no matter what is used to kill you. Dead is dead.

As far as Qana goes, there has been plenty of condemnation of the Israelis by the media for bombing the building yet no real condemnation of Hezbollah for using the structure, and other civilian structures for military purposes (which renders it a legit target under the Geneva Convention). From what I have read the building collapsed six hours after the strike so who knows, maybe it was a secondary explosion that collapsed it :rolleyes:

One of the main reasons why so many civilians are killed these days is usually down to them being used as human shields in an urban environment. Think Bosnia, Somalia, Iraq, Lebanon etc etc. Even the UN observers that were killed by Israeli fire were being used as a shield by Hezbollah. I doubt very much that the Chinese observers that were hit by Hezbollah mortar fire were anywhere near Israelis however. Terrorists don't care who they hit.

You would be surprised at the amount of legal BS that actually goes on before any target is hit, and even more surprised at the amount of targets that are struck off the list as a result (and creating further friendly military casualties as a result on occasion). Targets that are hit usually have the minimum amount of of ordnance to do the job due to fear of collateral damage to the surroundings. Israel is using bunker busting bombs as the extent of Hezbollah defenses is greater than anticipated. Towns have been prepared over years with towns built under towns, and it creates a lot less damage hitting specific locations than wiping a town off the map after a weeks bombardment.

The media continually gives out half-stories and half-truths due to either agenda driven reporting or incompetence. How many stories have you seen or read about of schools or such like being blown up in Iraq? The media rarely report that said school is so full of explosives and ammunition (another breach of the Geneva Convention) that is is unsafe to remove, so therefore it's blown in place. And to top it, how often do you see a story in the media about coalition troops helping to rebuild the school and equip it? :glare:

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